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Post by sprint logic on Aug 26, 2009 6:19:24 GMT -8
A lot to talk about .. This was an interesting competition .. Check this out: theviewfromthefinishline.blogspot.com/There was also the Semenya thing going on .. And the whole drug thing with the Jamaican athletes .. Actually Jamaica was central to the meet in more ways than one ... Five popped athletes ... MVP not supposed to be there, instated by IAAF, big part of the Jamaican success .. US fewer medals than Beijing .. No 4x1 in either final - two years in a row now ... LOTS to discuss ... But everyone seems shy .. |
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Post by canmak60 on Aug 26, 2009 9:03:31 GMT -8
I would like to comment on the situation with the JAAA and the MVP Athletes, or more correctly with the JAAA and Stephen Francis. While I believe that rules are to adhered to, there is a need to examine whether a rule, in this case the "The Mandatory Camp" rule, is in the best interest of the athletes.
It is my view that it is not in the best interest of the athletes for the JAAA to arbitrarily set a date for a mandatory camp. What they are doing is telling the coaches that their athletes have to be at their peak by the date that they determine. The date of a mandatory camp is to be set in conjunction with the coaches.
Common sense or what is best for the athletes does not always dictate what the JAAA does. Ego and who is the "bigger man" are often the motivating factors.
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Post by Seabiscuit on Aug 26, 2009 11:07:36 GMT -8
Interesting subjects and 'cam'...nice reply. I believe I can dissect it for you. ;-) but first, I'll address SprintLogic's queries.
Semanya - If she passed the chromosome test that one presumes they did on her, there is no issue here.
JAAA v. MVP - While a number of Jamaican posters elsewhere feel that the JAAA is disorganized and/or poorly managed, IAAF meddling has not helped. It is more likely that they have rendered that federation impotent. Internal meddling such as this makes one wonder who invested IAAF may be in specific camps in Jamaica. Moreover, Jamaica's MVP-gate coupled with the UKA - Dwain Chambers saga illustrates that the IAAF can be quite arbitrary in their determinations of what is or is not "good for the sport."
The Jamaican 'FabFive' - The issue was handled appropriately...see 'strict liability' rule.
US relays - (see 5th grade t&f)
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Post by sprint logic on Aug 28, 2009 5:43:51 GMT -8
My take on the JAAA camp is this .. The idea of the camp is to pull everyone together as a unit ... Go over fine tuning .. I don't see "peaking" as having anything to do with it, simply because we're talking about the beginning of the World Championships (or Olympics) ... If you are not ready when the athletes village opens up, then you just won't be - nothing that happens from that point forward will change it ..
Not joining the rest of the team in the village is a slap in the face on so many different levels ... An exercise of refusing to accept authority ...
Now if we were talking about a camp in the middle of the summer I would have a different opinion .. But we're talking about the beginning of the meet ...
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Post by zoser on Aug 28, 2009 7:52:52 GMT -8
Semanya has been handled terribly and it is another mark against the IAAF in my book.
MVP v JAAA is another black mark against the IAAF in my book. We all know Francis is a contrary person and has authority issues. The JAAA did their job, they informed them about camp and Francis had time to fight this fight over the last 6 months, so the suspensions were a result not a reaction, huge difference. That being said rightly or wrongly the JAAA made an in house decision that was mysteriously overturned or should I say mediated by the IAAF for the betterment of the sport according to IAAF spokesperson Davies. Why was the inclusion of these athletes better for the sport??? The meet had not started yet, but the excuse was for the betterment of the sport. Which one of these athletes was marquee? Upon further examination I find world class times in front of those in this group that won and those that lost. 9.58/9.71 are world and american records. 52,98 is a great time under all circumstances. 49 flat speaks for itself. 10.75 wins 99% of all previous champs. SO why did we need these athletes? It has made the IAAF look very suspect. And another black mark
Now the US got new leadership and after Biejing they blamed the relays for all the woes of the team. All the while ignoring the FACT that we brought home the second most medals ever in a major, even without the relays and jumps. So we revamped all this and had the bogus Project 30 and restructuring of the power pyramid. We had the relay program nixed and we were told the waste would be done away with and the relays would have clarity. Instead we have more politics, less experienced people making decisions, and 2 dq's to match last season. Here is a question I will bring to this board, ask yourself why three 4hers were used in the prelim of the 4x4 instead of the third best American this summer was in camp. We used a man that failed to make the final and clearly was not fit, and another who admitted he was nursing a hamstring injury.
Overall I thought the champs were surreal. Too much going on externally to really get into the performances. Made me sad really, and I am not the only person that shares this feeling.
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Post by sprint logic on Sept 2, 2009 5:48:59 GMT -8
Yeah, I had a hard time getting into this meet ... Nothing after Bolt but a lot of "issues" ... Took away from the meet for me ...
The whole US leadership thing is becoming a joke ... Relay spots in that 4x4 were made on reputation not performance if we're going to be real ...
The IAAF has completely overstepped its boundaries ... Its job is not to run federations ... Its job is not to control drugs ... Federations run federations and WADA is in place to deal with drugs ... The IAAF is running around both ...
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Post by Seabiscuit on Sept 2, 2009 11:48:16 GMT -8
My post-worlds thoughts?
1. The times are getting other-worldly in the sprints. It is upstaging competition (only a precious FEW run those times) to the point that a five-time WRH (Powell) couldn't keep up with an injured Tyson Gay and an "85%" Usain Bolt. Sorry kids---the track may have been fast but lord KNOWS this is getting more incredible (read, UNBELIEVABLE) every day. Do not tell me about stride lengths, drive phases, nutrition and spikes. Baldersheist, I tell ya! YES, I am a NON-BELIEVER. I am not accusing the athletes, I am a skeptic of this sport (see point 2 for justification)
2. A coach had five athletes get popped for banned substances and held out of the games. Mr. Trevor Graham must be feeling like a real step-child at this point because LORD KNOWS if this had occurred at SprintCap (even before Gatlin got set-up--another attempt to take out a coach considered "suspect") all hell would have broken loose! And yet I hear of private inquires by a federation whom the IAAF just forbade to keep order in said federation "for the good of the sport."
3. For the good of the sport? Isn't that the reason Lamine Diack gave to Marion (whom he considered to be "like a daughter" to him (his words, not mine) when she wanted to train with Charlie Francis? Wonder if he considers Bolt "like a son" to him and whether he 'counsels' him to move away from Mills?
4. What happened to Wariner? Should one really believe that a SOLID 43.5 guy slides all the way to 44.6 based only on a coaching change? If the coach was all THAT, wouldn't he have someone else down there challenging Merritt? C'mon folks! What are we lookin' at here?
5. Even a skeptic like me wanted to see a track meet with a bit of drama, competition, sense of the unknown. There wasn't a SINGLE race in the sprints where we ALL couldn't pick the winner before the gun went off. What's wrong with this picture?
6. Finally, what the HELL happened to Patton and Jeter? Both came with little short, choppy, unpowerful strides. Neither got close to their PR's did they?
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Post by zoser on Sept 2, 2009 12:04:56 GMT -8
Seabiscuit it was not one coach it was one country. Said coach had one test positive and another non Jamaican rumored.
Being able to pick the winner of the sprints is not new. The performances are.
An 85% Bolt! LMAO
Yes in this case that coaching change was huge. And in a race that long a second is not that big of a difference. Pookie messed up changing coaches and it will take him a year to get back to where he needs to be. He did damn well to medal this year.
Doc cramped in the final. Jeter ran her second fastest race of her life in that final.
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Post by sprint logic on Sept 4, 2009 9:29:44 GMT -8
There were five athletes, and two of them belonged to the coach in question ...
I think what seabisquit is focusing on are the times .. In a matter of two seasons what was once outstanding (9.8-low) is an afterthought ... Never before have we seen a shift like this ... Nor have we ever seen an improvement curve (actually no curve looks like a fall off a cliff) ... Nor have we seen so many at the top so far ahead of the rest in such a short period of time ...
Bolt 85% - whatever
I said when he made the change it was a mistake ... All that talk about we're doing the same workouts - please !!!! Same workouts and he's having trouble running sub45 ... Kiss my ----
Tired of hearing about Doc cramping in that final ... He looked no better in the relay ...
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Post by Seabiscuit on Sept 9, 2009 13:29:49 GMT -8
I hear everyone except Tyson Gay doing nothing little more than begging Bolt to come run their event so that he brings "the money" with him. Long jumpers, q-milers and even a tongue-in-cheek challenge from a hammer thrower, lol...all 'challenge' Bolt to come run their event.
Also heard that Bolt declined $U.S. 500k for Shanghai and Daegu because he is tired. Folks, for a cool million, I think I could tough it out, lol. Amazing. And he is that much better than anyone else in the sport....head and shoulders miles beyond. Oh well, tell the young sprinters to learn to catch the pigskin because there seems to be no money in the sport anymore unless Bolt makes it.
Not criticizing Usain, not saying he doesn't deserve it, not saying he should not bid up his appearance fees. But hell he cannot run at EVERY track meet and organizers can't seem to fill stadia unless he is there.
Maybe we can train a few kangaroos to hop/bound in a circle to make some competition for Bolt? Seriously, what the heck is the sport going to do? Everyone says "It's good for the sport" that Usain runs so many WR's. (Spearmon, e.g.) I'm not so sure.
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